klanger

Putting aside recreational use for a moment and concentrating on medical use ok?

Marinol isnt as effective as the real thing, because it has had the THC removed. The THC is what effects some kind of endorphin in the brain to produce "happy" thoughts. Generally, before a medical patient can get to the "high", the herb is actively starting to subdue pain. Unfortuantely, like most pain medications we take via the dr/pharmacist, the patient has to put up with the side affects (feeling euphoric, "high"). This is one of the most common complaints by medicinal patients, as most of them are more interested in the pain relief and nausea relief than "getting high".

[Dr Notcutt, who heads up a UK goverment funded medicinal marijuana research program, said it was a misconception that those suffering debilitating illnesses would receive the same feeling from the drugs as recreational users or that they would take such high doses. "A lot of patients are incapacitated by the pain but they don't want to be incapacitated by taking so much that they get high."] Go here to read more data on this, as well as other medicinal marijuana information. http://www.budbuddies.com/cannabis_helps.htm

I think the difference between recreational and medicinal is much the same as:

Using an inhaler for asthma and using an inhaler for the fun of it, if you take two people one with asthma and one without and give them both the same inhaler, the asthma sufferer will feel the benefit of the medicine and feel they are able to breath properly again, the person who doesnt have asthma will get a high from the inhaler, their heart will race and they may feel heady too, its the same for recreational users of cannabis and those that use it for pain/nausea relief.

It doesnt cure all pains though, for instance if you use it when you have a headache for some reason it will actually intensify the headache not get rid of it. It will however help a cancer patient eleviate the pain as well as an aids patient, it will also help you feel better if you are feeling nauseous. Nausea is the #1 symptom that aids patients treat with medicinal usuage.

It can also be used to help all sorts of people with other medical problems, I have heard that people with IBS (Irritable Bowel Syndrome) often suffer with other problems (besides often times pain & nausea), high anxiety and depression being the two classics that go hand in hand with IBS... anxiety because they fear leaving the comfort area of a toilet close by, never knowing if they are going to be in severe pain within minutes of leaving home, depression because they are now faced with a diet that is incredibly boring, no tea coffee dairy onions red meats most root vegatables, even baked beans will trigger enormous pain because of the "wind factor". Their diet is extremely limited, most foods at a function or at a restaurant will have them within minutes writhing in pain. So what do they do? Stay at home for the rest of their lives so that they can be near the toilet, dont go to any family occasions because they cant eat what is being served. Its no life thats for sure. Yeah there are medicines that they can take to try and help but at present there is no cure for IBS. So what medicines do they take? anti-depressents to deal with being depressed, anxiety tablets to lessen the anxiety, anti spasmodic tablets to aleviate the stomache going into spasms, all of which attack the lining of the already tender stomache and create a new pain of their own... I wonder if IBS sufferers rattle when you shake them . Yet for those that have found cannabis, they have found that nearly all of those sysmptoms are kept under control without the need of a tablet cocktail. So it's ok to take a cocktail of pills that will cause lasting damage but not ok to use a herb that can replace all of those tablets? How bizaar.

I believe it has only been in the last hundred years that using cannabis has been seen as a crime in some countries/states. Prior to that its benefits were widely known and regularly used. Presidents and Royalty alike were users, Queen Victoria (late 1800's early 1900's England) was prescribed and used cannabis for her cramps... menstral pains, she drank it in tea.

[Cannabis has had a long history of use as an analgesic, and was widely used in 19th century Britain, including in the royal household. Dr. J. Russell Reynolds, Fellow of the Royal Society and Physician to Queen Victoria reported in the Lancet in 1890 that he had been prescribing cannabis for 30 years and considered it "one of the most valuable medicines we possess". According to Reynolds Indian hemp remained effective as an analgesic for months and even years without an increase in the dose.]

There have been a few former presidents of the USA that have used and grown great plantations of cannabis, Washington and Jackson ring a bell but I am not totally sure of those two. There have also been recent Presidents that admitted to having it in their mouths but not inhaling??? lol

Even today in the States there is a group of people that are supplied by the US government cannabis cigerettes to help with the pain that they are in, and yet in the same breath that very same government states there is no medical proof that this stuff works, so why are they supplying them? Just to see? well they have had 25 years "just to see". By the by, it is common citizens that are growing this stuff for the government to distribute [albeit professors & students at the University of Mississippi], seems to me like a typical example of do as I say and not as I do.

I dont use cannabis myself, yeah I have tried it and dont like the feeling it gives me any more than I like the feeling of being drunk. But I have witnessed its use both as a medicine and as a recreational drug, I can tell you the results are very different. A funny side effect of it is that it acts like a truth searum, just basically relaxes the person, makes them more chatty and more likely to tell the truth, so if you have any questions to ask a partner and you really want the truth, have them smoke some first

Why would you have cut it out Dak? hehehe just teasing

If all children were tagged from birth then most kids I think would consider it normal and nothing to worry about. What had sparked that line of thought in me a few years ago, was a baby that was taken by someone in nurses uniform from a maternity wing, and (not sure which way round these events actually took place) the taking and subsequent rape and murder of little Sarah. Now whilst I know these things don't happen that often here in England, once is once too many in my books especially if having a device such as I mentioned before could have pin pointed the whereabout of Sarah long before the man did his deed and destroyed her. You know the saddest part to that case? The devestation felt by her mum and dad and siblings, each feeling guilty for their own reasons lead to the break up of that family, so the children had to sit back and swallow the cruel death of their sister who they had been with moments before she disappeared and then watch their family crumble and fall before their very eyes.

As you say, you would have found a way to cut it out of yourself, I wonder too if as a child you refused to wear a seat belt in the car, or refused to hold your mothers hand when crossing the road, both of those come down to the same thing as a tracking device...... your parents just want to make sure you have the chance to grow up. Just my thoughts, on this subject, not saying you are wrong or I am right or even visa versa

We don't have kids yet.

 

I wonder whether the whole premise here is flawed. Maybe instead of working on better ways to track these perverts' date=' and wondering if those methods violate their civil rights, we need to instead work on better ways to track the children, who have no civil rights to violate in the first place. ID bracelets with built-in GPS, DNA sample and fingerprinting encoded on a chip, and a central database. Mandatory. Records deleted when they hit 18.

 

Thoughts?[/quote']

 

I had suggested to our local authority a few years ago, that with the developments within the electronics field, and the fact that recievers can be made so small these days, that why cant a system be devised for tracking children. Pretty much like the one that is in a dogs ear or neck that allows the dog recue to locate its owner, but more high tech and in line with the ones in peoples cars so that the child could actually be seen via a satalite.

 

To have one of these devices inserted at birth, my line of thought being that within minutes of the child disappearing they would be located and probably live to tell the tale, rather than the endless days/weeks long wait for bad news. I was told it goes against their civil rights to privacy, but as a mum I place their lives slightly higher than their rights for privacy. By all means have it disabled when they reach the age of 18, until that age they are the responsibility of the parents, and the parents are responsible for their behaviour. I felt this made perfect sense to me, the only kids that need to be wary of "big brother" would be the ones that are doing things they shouldnt be doing.

 

So to have a child tagged from birth would serve two purposes, firstly as a defence against abduction/kidnap and pedophiles, and secondly as a way to ensure we get under control the ever increasing youth offenders.

 

But I was told catagorically NO........ Funny how we value knowing where our vehicles are more than we value knowing where our kids are.......priceless!

Fine, I am sure Sayanora can prove whether you are him or not. He can see everyone's ip.

Sorry RedAlert, but that comes across as threatening. What difference does it make whether a person writes in the same style as another or is infact the same person using a different nick? Does it really matter?

Most of us hide behind a mask on the net anyway, otherwise there would be no need for a "nick/username" in the first place.

IMHO he merely opened up a line of debate, the fact that people answered clearly indicates that it was not a pointless one.

It cost me £45. two years ago for medical cover while in the USA for one week. I would strongly advise that you make sure you have cover, even if at the end of your trip you havent needed to use it, it will have still been a good buy.

ooops sowwy I spelled your nick wrong Husmusen

Hey there Husmusmen,

Thank you for clarifying what you were saying, your comments before had flown so far over my head that they hadnt even managed to part my hair

In short I totally agree with you, I wasnt advocating that kind of behaviour in the army, merely using it as an example of how a persons morals as such can change according to the circumstances that they find themselves in. Maybe it was a bad example.

klanger:

 

 

1. There are specialist military training systems for interrogaton

resistance. Contact counselling behind the mess hall on the other hand

is neither rigourous or beneficial.

 

2. The 'toughening up' excuse has been used for far too long by the

little Corporal Himmelstosses' date=' and they exist in every military,

as justification for their own personal sadistic fun.

 

Instinctively I feel that a long history of being bastardised would

probably help an enemy interrogator as the connection of

obedience/compliance == reward/ceasing of suffering is something that

an interrogator could use.

 

Now compare a soldier who loves and trusts his fellow teammembers with

his life? How much harder to betray them than a bunch of sadistic bastards

who've been grinding your face in the dirt since day one?

 

Just MHO.

 

Cheers.[/quote']

 

I have no idea who or what a corporal Himmelstosses is.

 

My ex husband was in the army and while we were based at a training centre in Pribright I came to know about one particular sergant who used bullying as a means of glorifying himself.

 

He had used recruits as gold tees, making them hold the tee in their mouths as he swung his golf club at the ball, one soldier ended up with a lot of stitches to his face as a result of missing... This is outright bullying and totally unnecessary in my opinion.

 

Another soldier had pissed him off so he made the soldier lick his dogs bottom, again totally uncalled for and served no purpose other than to have total control over that soldier and any career within the services.

 

Other soldiers would have their cigerettes taken from them to make them do what ever part of the combat training they needed to do, I could kinda see the reasoning behind that one, however, upon completion of that training session this sergent then sold those cigerettes back to the respective soldiers at an unreal price, again bang out of order in my books.

 

I reported this sergent to the commanding officer and he was moved from the training depot.

 

Your last comment was to do with trusting your team members, trust is something that is earned not automatically given, if you have a team member that is mentally weaker than the rest, his pals wont trust him to save their lives should they need it, if he has proven at other times that he is unreliable.

 

I dont agree with the bullying like that of the examples I gave above, that is extreme in my opinion, I do however, believe that we need both mentally and physically strong service people in order to cope with what they will come across in a war type situation.

 

Where does morality come from?

 

How do you determine what is right and wrong?

 

Is there really such a thing as “right” and “wrong?”

 

And why do you believe the way you do?

 

I don’t want to start a big fight or anything' date=' I just want some quick comments, and maybe some discution.

 

Ty[/quote']

 

 

I believe the basis for all our morals comes from God held within the ten commandments.

 

From there the individual societies that you grow up in add or remove a few of their own.

 

Your parents and those in authority around you try to instil in you a good sense of marality as you grow and learn. They endeavour to teach you right from wrong based somewhat on the origional ten commandments, and what society expects.

 

As an adult you yourself will have either accepted most of what you have learned, added to it through experience or even taken away some of what you learned as a child.

 

I think most people have the same opinion on some of the origional ten commandments, whether they believe in God or not, but it very unlikely that all of us will agree on all of the commandments. Or even agree on what is morally right or wrong 100%. As I said, society, parents and even yourself sway those origional commandments to suit a particular set of circumstances that you are in at the time.

 

Lets take bullying for an example. Most of us will agree that bullying is wrong and should be stamped out, I dont think this one is covered in the commandments but is most certainly one that quite a few societies find wrong.

 

However, in most military establishments within the training regime for young male and female recruits, bullying is rife. Now whilst we may agree that bullying is wrong, some will change their opinion in this instance and say its ok in the army because.... "we need to have strong people that will stand and face the enemy and not run from them, and bullying in the early days of training will weed out the weak from the strong". Some will say "bullying is totally unacceptable and should be stamped out emmediately", and some will say "we need to find a happy medium". So what happens now?

 

In England bullying within the military is a serious crime, those in charge are not allowed to touch the recruits or scream abuse at them, but what happens to this now mix match of troops when they go into a war situation. If a weaker soldier is captured and tortured how will he/she cope, will the long term effects be more dibilitating than perhaps the stronger soldier who previously would have survived the initial training?

 

I dont necessarily know the answer to any of this, I do know that we will all have oppinions based on it.

 

What it boils down to is a quote that I have heard repeated several times in my life.

 

You can please some of the people all of the time, you can please all of the people some of the time.... but you cant please all of the people all of the time.

uhmmm I think we are talking at cross purposes here Bettina, back in 89 I had just got a Pat Benatar album when I found out I was pregnant with my second child, I absolutely fell in love and was deeply moved by the song "suffer the little children" which was about a little girl that had been taken mmmm in the states I think, her name was Melissa. The song so moved me that I wanted to call my baby Melissa if I were to have a girl. seven months later through a negligent doctor I lost my baby and she died within me, we felt it innapropriate to then call her Melissa too, she was buried as Cassandra Jane. Three years later I had another baby girl but the name Melissa was still too tender for me, so we chose Aimee as her first name and Melissa as her second. I appologise for the confusion and any distress this has caused you, don't be sad Bettina it was a long time ago now, and I have come to terms with it, I will never forget her, but it no longer hurts like it did when I think about her.

I am so sorry but I don't know who Jessica is, and if you feel unable to talk about her I will understand, I just want you to know that talking does help sweetheart it really does.

With regard to your own ghosts, you know it is us that keep them there, we wont let them go till we have gone through a whole gambit of emmotions in dealing with them, ranging from guilt anger acceptance and then finally we are able to move on, it is only then that ghost leave us alone. There is no hard and fast rule as to when this should take place, for some people its is very soon for others it can take years, there is no shame in the length of time it takes for anyone to reach acceptance, all that matters is that you are finally able to get there. My heart goes out to you in this battle my thoughts are with you.

Hugs sweety

I dont usually use the word Ironic anyway, if things go pear shaped just as you think you are plain sailing I generally refer to it as "sods law", quite who sod was I have no idea, I guess its probably just an old term used when things dont go quite according to plan, just like "that put a spanner in the works" I spose. Dont take things for granted I spose.

Yes it is very sad Bettina, the baby I lost was as a direct result of a negligent doctor who just didnt see the symptoms and act on them. Melissa was indeed another little girl from quite a few years ago who was taken by a peadophile, she was found dead some time later locked in a suitcase, the post mortem claimed she had died in the case and not before. Pat Benatar wrote and sang a song in her memory "suffer the little children", I can give you the words to that song if you want, but you will need the tissues ready, its soul destroying. The information about Melissa I got from a tape of Pat's that I had many years ago, it was on the inside cover.

The above three poems are ones I wrote back in the early 90's for my three children.

Michael

I see in you a change thats good

you're turning away from becoming a 'hood'

My Michael has become loving and caring

having stopped all that futile daring

You have a keen sense of right and wrong

you even sing in tune to song

at night you sometimes wet the bed

I know the problem, its in your head

The insecurities you are feeling now

we'll milk them like a dairy cow

we'll build your confidence oh so high

till every morning you'll find you're dry

We'll fight those battles one by one

exorcising those ghosts until they're gone

and when at last you become a man

you'll find in me your biggest fan

Aimee Melissa

Should you ever wonder why

of all the names here under the sky

how did we decide upon

Aimee Melissa it seems so wrong

Aime is a word of love

no better name to be prouder of

Melissa is another time

the doctor she will pay for her crime

Your elder sister had she lived

would have had that name for what a bad man did

he took a child so fresh and new

what he was doing he damn well knew

When finished he looked at her telling face

and so he locked her in a case

no more to laugh no more to cry

and there that baby slowly died

Moved to tears I knew what to do

that little girl can now live through you

so that's how we decided upon

Aimee Melissa, it's not so wrong

Nathan

You could never truely know

the fear inside as I felt you grow

that one day you might also die

or that I might reject at the sound of your cry

You were born to this world a wonderful gift

and gave my heart a beautiful lift

so different were you a gift from above

one look at you and I was in love

You came at a time of dreadful sorrow

you enabled me to look toward tomorrow

so different and in so many ways

I found I could run forward instead of sway

One day you may wonder why you're not the same

as MIchael and Aimee but Pearson's your name

"but they are blond, and I am brown"

I can hear your question, see your frown

I cant honestly say what made you so

I guess that's something we'll never know

your differences were made in a loving act

to your ultimate creator I tip my hat

I love you as when with that first stare

I was dazzled by your shock of hair

with your Scottish blood you are a heathen

but to me you are my sweet sweet Nathan

I dont think its so much that we learn to like pain as learn to tolerate a certain amount of pain.

For instance how many adults do you know that go into full on hysterical screaming and crying when they get the flu jab? Yet babies do when they get their immunisations (bar those unfortunate babies that are born with no sence of pain).

Pain is an important sense, it allows us to know the difference between feeling fine and feeling ill, it is a danger sign for us, just as the hairs rising on the back of your neck is a danger sign and allows us to control the situation to some degree.

If there were no pain sensations for everyone it could be life threatening and you wouldnt know, women would be having babies where they stand, a man cleaning windows that falls off the ladder could be bleeding internally from a torn spleen and wouldnt know.

Do we like pain? Well other than people that are into S+M who actually enjoy the pain for control, be it in their hands or someone elses, yeah I think we do like the sensation of pain, I dont enjoy pain, but I do like having it, it allows me to know the difference between feeling good and feeling that something is wrong or needs attention within me.

LOL Quick Silver

That came from the film Con-Air, about a bunch of criminals that had taken over the plane that was transporting them elsewhere. The song was Sweet Home Alabama. Which brings me to another song that was full of irony, cant remember the title but some of the lines

a no smoking sign on your cigerette break

an old man turned 98 won the lottery and died the next day

a death row pardon two minutes too late

meeting the man of your dreams.... and then meeting his beautiful wife

Anyway I seem to have gone off the beaten track somewhat so shall shut up now

WOW! poor you, I hope they dont scar too bad

Not saying that you havent had the chicken pox 7 times here Nevermore, but were they properly diagnosed by a doctor? Reason I ask is this.

I was friends with a lady who had two little boys, one of whom she felt had had chicken pox several times. It turned out that what she thought were chicken pox were actually an alergic reaction to something he occassionally ate. He came up in cigerette size red blotches that were slightly raised. Chicken pox comes up in cigerette size blisters, there is no red to them initially before they show, just bam a blister.

Also chicken pox generally cycles every 6-7 years, unless you move country and are just ahead of the strain each time I have worked out that you would have to be somewhere in the region of 42 - 49 years old.

That said, I do know the doctor told me one time that yes it is possible to get it more than once, but that that is a very rare thing.

Billy was a bull dog playing in the grass

along came an elephant and kicked him up the ......

arsk no questions and tell no lies

I saw a chinaman doing up his...

flies are a nuisance bees are worse

this is the end of my little verse

I voted yes, but that would have to be a yes with boundaries. If I could have life threatening traits removed, heart problems lukemia or any of those kinds of afflictions, then I would. I would NOT however want their mind reshaped or their looks perfected. I love the individuality of children and wouldnt want to ruin that with tampering, I would just wish for them a long life, no parent either expects or wants to outlive their children so if I could make those kind of things stop then I would.

there was a young lady from bod

who thought she'd been got at by God

but it wasnt the almighty

that got up her nightie

it was Roger her lodger the sod!

What about all the kids that struggle with schooling, havent been blessed with minds that can read and memorise whole texts. Is it fair to them that because a student can ace it with their eyes shut that that student should then be distruptive in class becaude they are "bored".

Teachers have a tough time, yeah the holidays must be great, but who wouldnt need that time off after spending everyday with 30 kids.

If no one pushed you through school then it would appear to me that they didnt see why they should when you couldnt be bothered to do what work was already being set for you, good grade or not. Its kinda like flogging a dead horse, a total waste of time and energy. They probably had kids there that wanted to learn.

I know nothing about the vaccine, as when I had the chicken pox and my kids got it it was pre any vaccine here in England back in 89 - 93. If this is a tried and tested method with no nasty side effects then yeah that has got to be the way to go.

My interpretation of a vaccine though is for it to contain the virus in a very small dose so that your wite blood cells attack it and then you have your immunity.

So with that in mind I am not convinced that seeing as you have now had chicken pox via a vaccine, that you will somehow manage to escape from shingles too. By the way not everyone that gets chicken pox get the shingles later, and I dont think getting shingles is connected solely to catching chicken pox as an adult, I believe that once you have had the chicken pox regardless of age a little of the virus remains within you, and that if your immune system becomes low at some point in adult life that is when it can comes back to bite you. It is usually in the form of a patch of dry rough skin that looks like heat rash, but just in one place normally, with an intense itch that hurts if you scratch it.

As I said I am not toatlly sure as to how vaccines work, so if anyone knows for sure I would be interested to know.