[Reaper]

Well, I think it is now clear that gas prices in the United States will only be going up from now on, not down. Up here in my native state of NH it is $3.90 at the pump currently, and $4 per gallon is not that far off. I've been reading reports that gas prices in California are beginning to reach $5 per gallon, and I'm sure that soon that will be the case here in the Northeast.

Though it is not yet that high, these prices are already starting to really become quite painful for many people with our big fat gas guzzling cars. In my area, there is no light rail, no bus, etc. Gas prices are already high enough to make my father start taking his bike to work rather then his car for example (a rather good choice I say, because his work is only about 3-4 miles out of the way).

My own car has about 30 mpg, but at $5 per gallon, I'm not sure just how much that is going to matter, and I am going to be needing it in the foreseeable future (which means that I'll have to pay for gas). It is however small, so maybe it will make a difference. But most of us around here aren't that fortunate.

I'm beginning to start about thinking about buying one of those really small, "smart" cars that are scarce in the market here in the U.S. right now, that or an electric car and do away with petro all together (if not that, then a hybrid). Additionally, I'm starting to use less hot water and trying to redesign the house so that it will rely much less on that gas heater of mine.

Unfortunately here in the States our options are so few, and there is not enough subsidies for renewable resources. The American auto companies aren't doing shit to solve any of the problems, the oil companies have the consumers by the throat, and we are being a bit slow to develop mass transit :doh:. What the hell are we to do about this :-(?

[Klaynos]

I would celebrate that the price has dropped to about half price...

In the UK it's not uncommon currently to pay $9/US Gallon

Sympathy here you will not find.

[iNow]

I had a feeling a post like that was coming. Thank you, Klaynos, for giving some context on this. :-)

[ecoli]

Klaynos said:

I would celebrate that the price has dropped to about half price...

In the UK it's not uncommon currently to pay $9/US Gallon

Sympathy here you will not find.

Pointing out that gas is expensive in europe doesn't make our gas cheaper than it is.

[Klaynos]

ecoli said:

Pointing out that gas is expensive in europe doesn't make our gas cheaper than it is.

True, but it gives you a nice idea that compared to other places you've got it good still... or at least better...

[Pangloss]

Sounds good to me. Let's throw 3 or 4 bucks a gallon of taxation in there instead of the 18 cents we're paying for federal taxes now. Solves the deficit and the energy crisis in one fell swoop. Of course that'll put us in recession for the next presidency, but Obama is all about change, right?

[swansont]

It's a failure of several administrations to have avoided ramping up the tax slowly, IMO. It wouldn't have been popular, and the oil and auto companies wouldn't have liked it, so it didn't happen. But it'd have been one way to actually reduce our oil imports, rather than just talk about it.

ecoli said:

Pointing out that gas is expensive in europe doesn't make our gas cheaper than it is.

No, but it gives some perspective to the notion that we somehow have a right to cheap gas, which is a notion shared by a fair number of Americans.

[Rev Blair]

We're right around five bucks a gallon right now, and Canada is more similar to the US, both culturally and taxation-perception wise, than Europe is.

Five bucks a gallon hasn't made much difference here. There's been some shift away from gas guzzlers and into smaller cars, but not even as much as we saw in the 1970s...at least so far. Mostly we just complain, then dig out our wallets.

[tvp45]

In the short term, i.e, less than five years, there are no solutions other than incremental improvements in conservation and efficiency. The US Department of Energy has a pretty decent information service at
www.eia.doe.gov
which provides forecasts, white papers on options etc. It appears to be slightly industry oriented and, thus, optimistic; nonetheless the picture is gloomy. Additional drilling, refinery expansions, alternative fuels, etc. are all perhaps decades away and may have hidden problems (such as the recently noted cost increase in nuclear power plants due to cement cost increases and the lack of skilled labor). Europe uses about half the per capita energy as the US and enjoys a comparable standard of living. We Americans will do well to emulate some of the European practices and that may, indeed, be our only choice that has any prospect for success.

[bascule]

The same thing I do already: don't drive my car.

My car has been broken for almost 3 weeks now, and so far I feel no incentive to try fixing it.

[ecoli]

Break out the bike

[CDarwin]

Rev Blair said:

We're right around five bucks a gallon right now, and Canada is more similar to the US, both culturally and taxation-perception wise, than Europe is.

Five bucks a gallon hasn't made much difference here. There's been some shift away from gas guzzlers and into smaller cars, but not even as much as we saw in the 1970s...at least so far. Mostly we just complain, then dig out our wallets.

Wait, whose bucks would those be? The greenback or the loonie?

[Ozone]

I would...buy more gas...I have to get to work...to buy more gas, etc.

If you increase the number of automobiles that will get 100 km/g you will increase the price of gasoline...because...they will be selling less.

Supply and demand. The record profits are not the consequence of malfeasance, but rather, people are buying more.

The bigger problem is the increase in the price of essentially everything (food, etc.). This is a consequence not of the price of gasoline, but of the price of the fuel of commerce, diesel (and to some extent, the diversion of our food into fuel). If you wish to fix this, a reasonable approach might be to increase the sulfur limit in diesel from 15 to 25 (or so) ppm.

unpopular,

O3

[ecoli]

Ozone said:

I would...buy more gas...I have to get to work...to buy more gas, etc.

If you increase the number of automobiles that will get 100 km/g you will increase the price of gasoline...because...they will be selling less.

Supply and demand. The record profits are not the consequence of malfeasance, but rather, people are buying more.

The bigger problem is the increase in the price of essentially everything (food, etc.). This is a consequence not of the price of gasoline, but of the price of the fuel of commerce, diesel (and to some extent, the diversion of our food into fuel). If you wish to fix this, a reasonable approach might be to increase the sulfur limit in diesel from 15 to 25 (or so) ppm.

unpopular,

O3

but, if the increased prices get people driving less, demand goes down, and so does price. I'd rather save the gas for truckers delivering my food, medical supplies and amazon.com purchases than for getting to work.

[CDarwin]

Ozone said:

If you increase the number of automobiles that will get 100 km/g you will increase the price of gasoline...because...they will be selling less.

That's not how supply and demand works. You've got it backwards.

Quote

Supply and demand. The record profits are not the consequence of malfeasance, but rather, people are buying more.

That's how it works. And it isn't just American buying more. It's increased consumption from the BRIC countries that isn't going away any time soon.

[ecoli]

CDarwin said:

That's not how supply and demand works. You've got it backwards.

It depends, I think. People will be buying less gas, so I think initially prices would skyrocket, to make up for the drastic reduction in revenue. But, competition would force prices down again.

[iNow]

Demand will go down, yes, but since it's a regulated market the more simplistic ideas of free market supply & demand don't really apply in the same way.

[swansont]

CDarwin said:

That's not how supply and demand works. You've got it backwards.

Normal supply and demand dynamics assumes a free market. Having a cartel as a major player kinda ruins that.

[brainslice]

I will invade Iran in an effort to spread democracy and free up some of that precious black gold.
Then I will go back to my ranch and cut firewood.

[blike]

I will poop blood.