Genetic Mutations?

[MajinVegeta]

In evolution, genetic mutations occur according to the enviromental changes. How EXACTLY does this happen? What initially makes the DNA mutate?? I really don't understand it.:confused:

[fafalone]

You try copying billions pieces of complex information, see how many mistakes you make ;)

[blike]

Random errors are selected for by nature. The bad ones are weeded out, and the good ones dominate.

[Skye]

Genetic mutations don't respond to environmental changes, other than things that directly interfere with the process, like UV rays hitting the atoms involved. Mutations are much like changing or removing or adding a word to a sentence so it rarely makes any improvements. If I removed the word 'rarely' from the previous sentence it would probably be just confusing to you. If I changed the words 'much like' to 'nothing like' it makes a comprehensible difference. I hope it's not an improvement though, or else I've been writing drivel.

[baigligan]

Originally posted by MajinVegeta
In evolution, genetic mutations occur according to the enviromental changes. How EXACTLY does this happen? What initially makes the DNA mutate?? I really don't understand it.:confused:

both cosmic and earth radiation are mutation factors.also chemical polution and some other things but they are not essential.do u know what horrible experimed made rissians at about 50 years ago.right after nuclear explosion 5000 solders passed trough centre where radiation was terrible high.today just one is alive.other are dead by cancer(in 98% of cases)all that i saw on "discovery chanel" an there was interview with this survivor.so this poor young guys was with terrible damaged DNA.so trough millions of years of evolution this little invissible rays changed slowly genes of creatures ,in 99,99% that was useless or even bad changes but this 00.01% was the usefull little bit wich natural selection kept alive(other with bad changes simply died)evolution is very slow process(comparing with human live)

[MajinVegeta]

That cleared up a lot. Also, another thing is the evolution of animals like how some dinosaurs became birds. How did that happen? I know that's still in debate so here's another example: human evolution.

[baigligan]

Originally posted by MajinVegeta
That cleared up a lot. Also, another thing is the evolution of animals like how some dinosaurs became birds. How did that happen? I know that's still in debate so here's another example: human evolution.

oh human evolution.its endless theme,but its proved that we originated from africa.wach "discovery channel"

[MajinVegeta]

Yes, I know. My problem is that I don't see how animals can "evolve". People will say "genetic mutation..." and blah blah. Can any1 explain the details??

[baigligan]

Originally posted by MajinVegeta
Yes, I know. My problem is that I don't see how animals can "evolve". People will say "genetic mutation..." and blah blah. Can any1 explain the details??


HI.earth conditions changing constantly.nobody can say how many ice periods was in the past.by changing conditions survive only fittest.they can find food better,theyr bodies can safe temperature better.so they will survive.the death is the main evolution engine because ,the death selected the fittest creatures.there must be some reason for people to evolve.they went into caves,man got hunters wimen got house keepers and that allow them to survive in age of ice.look the penguins on antarktica.when female lays the only egg she leave it to male to keep it warm between his legs.all together femails going for food(i forgot to mention that they are far from the coast)and mails should stay without food for a 4-5 weeks by temperatures -30/-40(sometime even -50) degree celsium.so they found the only way to survive.other wich didnt found it just died.may be the fittest human beings with good social structure survived.other are gone.

[Sayonara³]

If a gene or group of genes allow for a more effective organism, then the individuals with the genes are more likely to survive and therefore more likely to reproduce than those without the genes.

This is the basis of selection.

Random mutations in gene structure are a major contributor to more advantageous genes, although only a tiny percentage of mutations actually are advantageous.

[Skye]

Lets say happiness is measure of the 'fitness' of a species of organism, called Happius fascia. Normal Happius critters (:) ) have the gene 'hh' which codes for their smiley face. They produce a single identical offspring each generation. So a population of ten Happius critters would remain this number throughout time.

Generation 1
:) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)
Generation 2
:) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)

Now then occasionally an unfortunate Happius mutates, it's gene for it's smiley face changes to 'uh' which causes it to have the unhappy face :-( . These mutants are unable to reproduce because they are too unhappy, so they leave no descendents.

Generation 3
:) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :-( <---mutant
Generation 4
:) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) <---only nine Happius left

So unhappy mutants cause the population to fall in number. If this process continued over long periods of time than the Happius population would become exstinct. Fortunately an occasional Happius mutates to have the gene 'Hh' which causes it to be very happy like this: :-p . Because they are so happy these Happius produce TWO offspring each generation so that the population increases, and the proportion of Happius with the 'Hh' gene increases.

Generation 5
:) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :-p <--mutant
Generation 6
:) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :-p :-p <---offspring of the mutant
Generation 7
:) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :-p :-p :-p :-p

The population can't keep growing forever. This Happius populations territory can only sustain 12 Happius. Since the :-p (carrying the Hh gene) Happius are 'fitter' than the :)(carrying the hh gene) they outcompete them. So each generation the number of Hh Happius increases.

Generation 8
:) :) :) :) :) :) :) :-p :-p :-p :-p :-p
Generation 9
:) :) :) :) :) :) :-p :-p :-p :-p :-p :-p

....untill the hh Happius gene becomes extinct and the population is made up entirely of Hh Happius....

Generation 15
:-p :-p :-p :-p :-p :-p :-p :-p :-p :-p :-p :-p

And a population of hh Happius have evolved into a population of Hh Happius.

[Dudde]

strangely enough (and as scary as it is to think of) that actually made sense...

[baigligan]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Skye
[B]Lets say happiness is measure of the 'fitness' of a species of organism, called Happius fascia. Normal Happius critters (:) ) have the gene 'hh' which codes for their smiley face. They produce a single identical offspring each generation. So a population of ten Happius critters would remain this number throughout time.

Generation 1
:) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)
Generation 2
:) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)



hi.may be u are right.i agree because in ur exsample doesnt exsist natural selection just like in humans world.our stupid sence of humanity alowed modern medicine to keep alive many kind of genetic damaged people.they have theyr own offspring and its damaged too.that is the half of the problem.second half is that radiation and chemical polution atack genes of other healty people so the count of damaged people groving.
AN EXSAMPLE
genetic anomalos increased femail chormons in male child.groving up entering into teenagers world he is feeling half women half man,and some of them geting gays.we are talking about humans rights.ok,but this genetic mistakes doesnt work hard phisical work.they are singers,tv stars , show stars and theyr behavior is exsample for groving generation.to this who still doubt what kind themselves are.so gays are like desease-the only goal is expansion.and modern(twisted) sence of humans rights allow them to advertise theyr sicness.now as a resuld most people think that this is normal.bullsh!ts.totaly bullsh!ts

[Sayonara³]

Oh Jesus.

Someone PM me this guy's IP, I'm beginning to doubt he's in Bulgaria.

[baigligan]

Originally posted by Sayonara³
Oh Jesus.

Someone PM me this guy's IP, I'm beginning to doubt he's in Bulgaria.

sometime truth looks ugly- no matter u like it or not.

[Sayonara³]

...and it wasn't until the villagers actually started throwing the pitchforks that he realised he just didn't know when to shut up.

[baigligan]

Originally posted by Sayonara³


if u are one of this genetic mistakes of mother nature just tell me.i dont wanna talk with them even by internet. will stop imediately.if u are not i just wonder why u defend them.may be ur mind is modifyed by twisted modern conception of humanity that present constantly on tv screens.i suspect there are some kind of world sect.just look at pop stars-PRINCE,RHU PAUL, ELTON JOHN,BOY GEORGE,MICHAEL JACSON,GEORGE MICHAEL ,PHILL COLLINS(PHILL IS BISEXUAL) RICKY MARTIN(JOURNALIST FOUND HIM MAKING ORAL SEX TO A STRANGER IN THE TOILET OF VIP PARTY)AND MANY MORE ARE GENETIC MISTAKES BUT BECOME IDOLS FOR YOUNG PEOPLE JUST BECAUSE NOBOBY TELL THE YOUNG PEOPLE THAT IS ANOMALY. LIKE GAYS SAYD SOME DAY WE WILL BE THE BIGGER GROUP AN THEN WE WILL SEE WHO IS NORMAL AND WHO ISNT.THAT MEAN THE PLACES WILL BE CHANGED. THATS THE TRUTH NO MATTER U LIKE IT OR NOT. DONT TELL ME THAT THIS CROWD OF TRASH SHOULD BE IDOLS FOR YOUNG PEOPLE.

[Sayonara³]

So if there are gay people posting in this thread that means you stop talking about it?

[edit - can anyone guess where I'm going with this?]

[greg1917]

Was there a point to that huge homophobic outburst? there was ahtread ages ago about whether or not there was a 'gay' gene i think but people seemd to come to come to the reasonable consensus there are genes which to an extent behaviour so it will have an impact as well as their life experiences.

our stupid sence of humanity alowed modern medicine to keep alive many kind of genetic damaged people.they have theyr own offspring and its damaged too.

Sorry what? are you saying gay people are genetically damaged or are you seriosuly trying to suggest that concept of healing the sick is wrong? I presume your saying gays are a genetic mistake cos this merely shows intolerance, a reasonably high degree of stupidity and some right wing views. If you think medicine is wrong this shows that maybe the Chernobyl accident dumped a lot of radioactive material in your vodka supply.

This wasnt really prompted by anything, you seemd to suddenly attack 'our stupid sense of humanity' with this outburst. By humanity do you mean freedom? I know the USSR wasnt a big one for personal freedom but you dont have to wind back the clock....

[greg1917]

Sorry my english was almost as bad as his there, i didnt read it over

[Sayonara³]

Originally posted by greg1917
Sorry my english was almost as bad as his there, i didnt read it over I'd be more worried about your geography tbh :-p

[greg1917]

Whats wrong with my geography? Bulgaria was one of the socialist republics that made up the USSR wasnt it? Its south of Romania, sandwhiched between Romania and Yugoslavia

[greg1917]

Alright maybe my geography is bad, sandwhiched between Yugoslavia and the Black sea.

[Sayonara³]

Well, I suppose it's close enough to Bulgaria for him to be able to buy glowing vodka.

[Skye]

genetic anomalos increased femail chormons in male child

I guess you mean that the child has an extra X sex chromosome (XXY, though XXXY, etc are also possible). This leads Klinefelters syndrome, which is easy to recognise...some development of the breasts and hips, underdeveloped testes, little facial hair. It also makes someone afflicted by it sterile, due to the underdevelopment of the testes. By memory it occurs in about 1 in a thousand or two thousand births, not enough for them to take over the world.

The pop stars mentioned are all (relatively) normal males, based on appearances. There may be a heritable basis for homosexuality (maybe for heterosexuality too:) ) but it sure isn't chromosomal.

[baigligan]

Originally posted by greg1917
Whats wrong with my geography? Bulgaria was one of the socialist republics that made up the USSR wasnt it? Its south of Romania, sandwhiched between Romania and Yugoslavia

u are almost right.we are south of romania and east from yugoslavia,SO WHAT.after second world war americans and russian was victorious.they divide the europe by zones of influence.unfortunately that is the destiny of each small country after each big war. no one asking them what they like or dislike.

[baigligan]

The pop stars mentioned are all (relatively) normal males, based on appearances. There may be a heritable basis for homosexuality (maybe for heterosexuality too:) ) but it sure isn't chromosomal. [/B][/QUOTE]

look.i dont mean we should kill all gays. i am not Hitler .i just dont wanna see them on every tv programm and in every magasin adwertising theyr behavior and sickness. cause of Shizophrenia is genetic anomaly and we call it sickness.its proved that cause of homosexual persons is hormonal anomaly based on genetic anomaly.then why there are people who disagree that gays are sick persons.even on "Discovery channel" i saw the program named"sex sense" where doctors explaned how this chormonal disbalange change behavior of grooving person who is just about to become teenager.

[Sayonara³]

Blue eyes are caused by a lack of pigmentation.

This is due to a particular gene group.

By your logic people with blue eyes are freaks, a disease.

We shouldn't allow them on television or they will indoctrinate our children into their wicked paganistic ways.

[fafalone]

Originally posted by baigligan

its proved that cause of homosexual persons is hormonal anomaly based on genetic anomaly.then why there are people who disagree that gays are sick persons.


Wrong. While estrogen concentrations during birth are linked to homosexuality, there is no conclusive evidence this is either genetics-based or the only contributing factor. High estrogen levels are linked to effeminacy, and not all effeminate males are homosexual.

"i am not Hitler"
No, you just want to eliminate every group that's different from you. Way different from Hitler!

[atinymonkey]

Originally posted by baigligan
u are almost right.we are south of romania and east from yugoslavia,SO WHAT.

I'm guessing that either you are not from Romania, or yugoslavia forgot to tell you it dosn't exist anymore.

[greg1917]

Dont be picky now, slavs dont like that. Where in Bulgaria are u from by the way Baigligan

[Deslaar]

Originally posted by baigligan
its proved that cause of homosexual persons is hormonal anomaly based on genetic anomaly.then why there are people who disagree that gays are sick persons. [/B]

Not many people would agree. Male homosexuality is not anomolous, it's reasonably common.

Statistically speaking, the more older brothers you have, the more likely you are to be gay. Evidence suggests this is caused by the mothers hormonal response to the foetus and therefore it is epigenetic.

[baigligan]

Originally posted by Sayonara³
Blue eyes are caused by a lack of pigmentation.

This is due to a particular gene group.

By your logic people with blue eyes are freaks, a disease.

We shouldn't allow them on television or they will indoctrinate our children into their wicked paganistic ways.

u are wrong.genes of brown eyes are diminante.so to be with blue eyes ur mother and father should have blue eyes.lack of pigmentation mean bloody red eyes.there was such girl in our class when i was schoolboy.her eyes was red.every single hair was snow white even above the eyes(i forgot the name of this parts of the face-sorry)if u dont trust me ask doctors(no matter who)

[blike]

u are wrong.genes of brown eyes are diminante.so to be with blue eyes ur mother and father should have blue eyes.lack of pigmentation mean bloody red eyes.there was such girl in our class when i was schoolboy.her eyes was red.every single hair was snow white even above the eyes(i forgot the name of this parts of the face-sorry)if u dont trust me ask doctors(no matter who)

Half-way right. However blue eyed children can come from brown eye parents, if they're both heterozygous.

Mother: Bb Father: Bb

Both of these parents will have brown eyes, because brown(B) is dominate.

However, their children's genotypes may look something like: BB, Bb, bB, bb.

The fourth child has blue eyes, he is homozygous recessive.

There is a 1/4 chance that heterozygous parents with brown eyes can have blue eyed children.

of course, it is much more complex than this.

----

The reason albino's eyes look red is because they have no pigment, and the blood vessels in the back of the eye reflect light and make them look pink/redish.

Blue eyes are caused by a lack of pigmentation.

I believe there is an actual allele for blue eyes. The bey2 gene on chromosome 15 has a brown and blue allele. The gey gene on chromosome 19 has a blue and green allele. However, eye color is not as simple as this. How can two blue-eyed parents have a brown-eyed child?

[Sayonara³]

Originally posted by baigligan
u are wrong.genes of brown eyes are diminante.so to be with blue eyes ur mother and father should have blue eyes.lack of pigmentation mean bloody red eyes.there was such girl in our class when i was schoolboy.her eyes was red.every single hair was snow white even above the eyes(i forgot the name of this parts of the face-sorry)if u dont trust me ask doctors(no matter who) I said 'lack' of pigment. You are talking about 'absence' of pigment.

See Blike's post for a more comprehensive description.

If you still don't accept the argument, then simply replace "people with blue eyes" in my post to "people with red eyes". By your logic they are a disease that needs to be wiped out before they warp our children's fragile minds.


Blike: I'm not sure what your asking. Clearly the genetics involved would determine the phenotype, thereby controlling the pigments that are expressed and the proportions in which they are present.

[blike]

It was more of a rhetorical question demonstrating that it can't be as simple as the example that I posed above. If it were that simple, then two blue-eyed parents could not have a brown-eyed child.

[baigligan]

Originally posted by blike
It was more of a rhetorical question demonstrating that it can't be as simple as the example that I posed above. If it were that simple, then two blue-eyed parents could not have a brown-eyed child.

thats right. two blue eyed parents shouldnt hawe brown eyed child exept the case when the mother keep some secrets about the real father.

[JaKiri]

That's an oversimpflication of genetics.

[blike]

thats right. two blue eyed parents shouldnt hawe brown eyed child exept the case when the mother keep some secrets about the real father.

But there is documented medical evidence of two blue eyed parents having a brown eyed child.

That's an oversimpflication of genetics.

thx captain obvious ;)

[JaKiri]

Originally posted by blike
thx captain obvious ;)

That's my rank on another forum you know;

[Sayonara³]

Originally posted by MrL_JaKiri
That's my rank on another forum you know; Proudly sponsored by the cretins, dontchaknow.

[baigligan]

Originally posted by blike
Half-way right. However blue eyed children can come from brown eye parents, if they're both heterozygous.

Mother: Bb Father: Bb

Both of these parents will have brown eyes, because brown(B) is dominate.

However, their children's genotypes may look something like: BB, Bb, bB, bb.

The fourth child has blue eyes, he is homozygous recessive.

There is a 1/4 chance that heterozygous parents with brown eyes can have blue eyed children.

of course, it is much more complex than this.

----

The reason albino's eyes look red is because they have no pigment, and the blood vessels in the back of the eye reflect light and make them look pink/redish.



I believe there is an actual allele for blue eyes. The bey2 gene on chromosome 15 has a brown and blue allele. The gey gene on chromosome 19 has a blue and green allele. However, eye color is not as simple as this. How can two blue-eyed parents have a brown-eyed child?


yeah .i know that blue eyed child can be born by brown eyed parents when they have the genes for blue eye wich effect is neutralised by domination of brown one ,but there are some words in english that i should use and that i dont know.i feld bored to searsh in dictionary.